The Reality Of A Multiple Threat Close Quarter Knife Attack

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The Reality Of A Multiple Threat Close Quarter Knife Attack

Postby Darren Laur » Thu Mar 18, 2004 6:26 pm

After looking at this footage, ask yourself how would your training prepare you for this reality ????

http://download.consumptionjunction.com ... _16065.wmv


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Postby Van Canna » Thu Mar 18, 2004 8:39 pm

Shocking. But hard to discern what the situation is.

Who is getting knifed, who is doing the knifing, and where is this taking place?

Who are the people milling around?

Thanks, Darren
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Postby Stryke » Thu Mar 18, 2004 10:52 pm

Prison retribution yes ?

yup , no amount of training will get you out of that
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Postby Van Canna » Thu Mar 18, 2004 11:22 pm

Looked like a prison execution. 8O
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Postby Frank DiMeo » Fri Mar 19, 2004 1:29 am

Mr. Lars--
Thank you for your extremely thought-provoking post!
Another good dose of reality always helps us know better where our weaknesses lie.
Respectfully,
Frank
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Postby Rick Wilson » Fri Mar 19, 2004 7:16 am

Sobering.
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Postby Mark Weitz » Fri Mar 19, 2004 3:14 pm

This is bizarre. Judging from the prison issue monkey suits and handcuffs that are visible on one of the attackers, this looks to be a prison style execution (hopefully the guy lived, but I lost count of how many stab wounds were inflicted on the victim and there appears to be a growing pool of blood beside his back). 8O

What do we learn from this? This is most likely in a prison, an environment I hope most of us will not be in at some point in our lives (poor Martha Stewart). And if it's in a prison, you'd think that there'd be somebody monitoring the video images in a security station of some kind. That 's what I find so bizarre. No guards? Nobody with a tacer? Very strange.

I suppose we can extrapolate to the street but this video offers nothing in the way of possibilities for retaliation/defence on the victim side. He's already been tackled to the ground, controlled, and stabbed repeatedly. This is not instructional. It's voyeurism. One doesn't need to view this, though I'm not suggesting we censor this material, to learn something. The lesson here is, if you're thrown to the ground by two capable bad-asses who intend to knife you to death, you're dead. Period.

Does anyone on this forum require this information at this stage in their lives/training? :?: We can train to try to avoid the take-down and mauling but this video starts past the point of no return.

Just watched it again. Look at the first 5 seconds or so of the video. There appears to be in the foreground a blurry image of what looks like a security guard talking into a walkie-talkie. I'm amazed that several guards didn't descend on this scene within seconds of the attack, yet the circumstances can't be deteremined. This was probably well-planned, perhaps done at night, between shifts, whatever, when fewer than normal staff are present. Still, a thoroughly gruesome scene. Think I'll go freshen my cup of coffee.
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Postby Van Canna » Fri Mar 19, 2004 3:42 pm

Shocking but sobering.

Darren Laur is the master of "shock"

It is what imprints "reality" and not "fantasy" in our minds.

A scene like this,might well prevent some of us from doing something stupid that would land us in jail and possibly subject us to a similar fate. There is much subliminal learning in this video.

I remember the "hoopla" on this fora, generated last year by a story I wrote about a victim executing his tormentors with a .357 magnum, based on a discussion on the Italian martial arts forum, I peruse.

I like Darren's methods of shocking us out of martial fantasies. :wink:

I tell my readers that if they find something disturbing, to promptly exit the thread.
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Postby nick » Fri Mar 19, 2004 3:56 pm

I think there is a huge amount of information to be learned from this example of brutality.
If you take a slightly different veiw point.

What did the purps do right?

As the real-estate people say, “...location, location, location...”

The spot chosen for this attack allowed privacy, no interference and time to do the business.

Plan your work and work your plan.

Looks like they’re employing the old ‘high/low’ attack. As one goes low to hold the victim, the other goes high for the majority of the stabbing.

Do not act without reason.

Don’t be confused as to this being “caught” on tape. These guys are sending a message to both the prison community AND the guards. So, they do an extra five years. Tack that on to the one hundred and fifty years running concurrently.

What can we learn from this? Some things are;

watch your surroundings: Are you in a location that allows privacy, no interference and time for someone to do the business on you?

out numbered: Do the people at the next street corner seem to know one another and are they separating as you approach with looks to each other, possibly planning something?

cameras: Are you under the fallacy that security cameras actually mean anything?

Excellent (but brutal) clip to get people thinking. Thanks.

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Postby Guest » Fri Mar 19, 2004 4:00 pm

Not the frenzied rage filled stabbing from hollywood. Just slow deliberate thorough work. Yes makes me want to stay out of prison.

They even had the guys feet wraped in a belt. Not a chance, and no mercy shown, when we think it's over the guy gives him another going over just to make sure.

I wonder if the face in the foreground was an onlooker or a look out. No telling how many were in on the attack.

Horrifying spot to find oneself. Kind of opens ones eyes to how a weapons attack might play out. I could not believe how it went on and on and on.

Thanks Darren

Laird
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Postby Van Canna » Fri Mar 19, 2004 4:09 pm

Nick
What can we learn from this? Some things are;

watch your surroundings: Are you in a location that allows privacy, no interference and time for someone to do the business on you?

out numbered: Do the people at the next street corner seem to know one another and are they separating as you approach with looks to each other, possibly planning something?

cameras: Are you under the fallacy that security cameras actually mean anything?

Excellent (but brutal) clip to get people thinking. Thanks.



Superb points, Nick, thanks.
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Postby Van Canna » Fri Mar 19, 2004 4:11 pm

uglyelk wrote:Not the frenzied rage filled stabbing from hollywood. Just slow deliberate thorough work. Yes makes me want to stay out of prison.

They even had the guys feet wraped in a belt. Not a chance, and no mercy shown, when we think it's over the guy gives him another going over just to make sure.

I wonder if the face in the foreground was an onlooker or a look out. No telling how many were in on the attack.

Horrifying spot to find oneself. Kind of opens ones eyes to how a weapons attack might play out. I could not believe how it went on and on and on.

Thanks Darren

Laird


Smart comments, Laird.

There are so many ways "to be had" __ this is a lesson hard to learn for most of us.
:(
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Postby Darren Laur » Fri Mar 19, 2004 6:31 pm

Yes the clip was brutal and violent, but so are the streets!!!!! REALITY *****, and its because of this fact that many continue to ignore its lessons !!!!!!! Many good comments here on what happened and what can be learned, BUT the main message in this clip, IMO, is the MINDSET the attacker had, and the fact that YOU could be facing this guy (or the many thousands like him) one day. So what I learned from this video isn’t so much physical in nature, but more psychological. It questions how and why we train for the street. I posted this clip because I wanted it to “SLAP” us in the face of our perceived reality, especially those who state that their training is designed for the street. We all need to seriously and honestly ask ourselves this question:

“If faced with this guy tomorrow one on one (knowing how brutal and feral he is), would my martial art or self defence training be enough to prevail ?????”

Some will answer this question seriously and honestly and begin their journey, but most will continue to delude themselves caught up in their self-righteous beliefs that their physical skills (be they traditional or modern combatives) will overcome the mental. This, my fellow forum readers, is flawed thinking which will get one seriously injured or even killed on the street.


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Postby Van Canna » Fri Mar 19, 2004 7:30 pm

Great post, Darren, hard hitting and to the point.

George,

This is the kind of stuff that a "modernist" can contribute to awaken some of us to the reality of the defensive component so many are sold to take for granted.

We are so lucky to have a law enforcement officer of Darren's caliber to point us in the right direction.

Thank you Darren. Just the thought of having to face such a psychopath in the street, is enough to seriously question and change your entire training belief system. :(
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Postby Van Canna » Fri Mar 19, 2004 7:32 pm

but most will continue to delude themselves caught up in their self-righteous beliefs that their physical skills (be they traditional or modern combatives) will overcome the mental. This, my fellow forum readers, is flawed thinking which will get one seriously injured or even killed on the street.


Darren,

Can you get into the mental aspect in more detail for the new readers here?
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