Selective terrorists ?

This is Dave Young's Forum.
Can you really bridge the gap between reality and training? Between traditional karate and real world encounters? Absolutely, we will address in this forum why this transition is necessary and critical for survival, and provide suggestions on how to do this correctly. So come in and feel welcomed, but leave your egos at the door!
Stryke

Post by Stryke »

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Just because yopu may agree with the cause doesnt change the fact .
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Marcus, What cause do I agree with?
Hey Mike I should rephrase that

Just because you beleive THEY had cause doesnt change the fact .

I think bullying is right for how it was handled afterwards . I still think a group of bombers attacking non military targets to create fear is terrorisim .

The term seems pretty broad most of the time .

I guess there allies now ....
Guest

As a rule of thumb..

Post by Guest »

You cannot terrorize police and military because they are supposed to be fearless and without emotion.
IJ
Posts: 2757
Joined: Wed Nov 27, 2002 1:16 am
Location: Boston
Contact:

Post by IJ »

Perhaps that is the ideal, but they're all only human. I wouldn't want machines fighting for me anyway, unless they were made BY people, not OUT OF them.
--Ian
Guest

Post by Guest »

I'm speaking in terms of classifying insurgents.
User avatar
Bill Glasheen
Posts: 17299
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Location: Richmond, VA --- Louisville, KY

Post by Bill Glasheen »

Here's the nature of the people you are dealing with. These are the words of Jaques Chirac to Schroeder of Germany and Putin of Russia. (05-Jul-2005)

On the British...
One cannot trust people whose cuisine is so bad.

***

The only thing they (the English) have ever done for European agriculture is mad cow disease

***

After Finland, it is the country with the worst food.
Apparently there were two Fins on the committee who just today chose London over Paris for the 2012 Olympics. Hmm... Wonder why? :roll:

The following comment was made after Lord George Robertson (Scottish) - former Nato secretary general - "made" him try a local (Scottish) dish at the G8 summit.
That is where our difficulties with Nato come from
But what do we know? We're all peasants compared to the royalty of culture, cuisine, and world order.

Image

Cake anyone? :wink:

- Bill
User avatar
Bill Glasheen
Posts: 17299
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Location: Richmond, VA --- Louisville, KY

Post by Bill Glasheen »

This is Chirac's idea of fine cuisine.

Image

Pervert!

Image

- Bill
User avatar
Bill Glasheen
Posts: 17299
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Location: Richmond, VA --- Louisville, KY

Post by Bill Glasheen »

Definitions of terrorism on the Web

The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence against people or property to coerce or intimidate governments or societies, often to achieve political, religious, or ideological objectives. (JCS Pub 1-02)
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ ... 0020gl.htm

The use of extreme violence or the threat of violence by states, groups or individuals to generate fear in individuals and thus manipulate their behavior. Currently, most terrorism is drug or religion based. Some define the term widely to include topics like spanking of children or the teaching of an eternity of torture in Hell as forms of physical or spiritual terrorism.
www.religioustolerance.org/gl_t.htm

A criminal act that is undertaken with the purpose of achieving political gain. It may or may not be directed against a particular government, and it may or may not be state-sponsored. Defining terrorism is a very controversial subject because of the differing motivations of those who practice it. As the old saying goes, "One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter."
www.icons.umd.edu/pls/reslib/display_glossary

The systematic use of violence to achieve political ends is not new – among many other examples, it featured during The Troubles in Ireland before its independence in 1922. In recent decades, it has become a common tactic among a wide variety of groups, from independence movements to the secret services of various countries. Random bombings, shootings and/or 'disappearances' – and the fear and panic they provoke – put pressure on governments, proving that they are unable to protect their populations, or can be used by dictatorships to frighten their people into submission and obedience.
http://www.channel4.com/history/microsi ... ssary.html

Acts of murder and destruction deliberately directed against civilians or military in non-military situations.
www.jafi.org.il/education/hasbara/glossary.html

Any act including, but not limited to, the use of force or violence and/or threat thereof of any person or group(s) of persons whether acting alone or on behalf of, or in connection with, any organisation(s) or government(s) committed for political, religions, ideological or similar purposes, including the intention to influence any government and/or to put the public or any section of the public in fear.
www.ecis.org/finance/paisdefin.htm

As I explained in my first post on C&R, I use the same definition general definition of terrorism as the State Department: The Intelligence Community is guided by the definition of terrorism contained in Title 22 of the US Code, Section 2656f(d): The term terrorism means premeditated, politically motivated violence perpetrated against noncombatant targets by subnational groups or clandestine agents, usually intended to influence an audience. The term international terrorism means terrorism involving the territory or the citizens of more than one country. The term terrorist group means any group that practices, or has significant subgroups that practice, international
clarityandresolve.com/candrlexicon.php

use of terror, especially the systematic use of terror by the government or other authority against particular persons or groups; a method of opposing a government internally or externally through the use of terror
www.imuna.org/c2c/app_a.html

The use of violence for political purpose.
regentsprep.org/Regents/global/vocab/topic_alpha.cfm

"Systematic use of terror, manifesting itself in violence and intimidation. Terrorism has been used by groups wishing to coerce a govt in order to achieve political or other objectives, and also by dictatorships or other autocratic governments in order to overcome opposition to their policies." [BFH] Often anti-terrorist mercenaries will only do a job if they have a carte blanche to do whatever they want. The sole aim of the mercenaries is to enter the country, kill the terrorists, collect their money and leave as soon as possible. Innocent civilians nearby are expendable. It's up to the govt to
www.embassy.org.nz/encycl/t3encyc.htm

Area: Human Psychopathology Text Pages (est.): 3 Paul Bell South and East Belfast Health and Social Services Trust
208.164.121.55/reference/STRS/strestoc.htm

a violent act in violation of the criminal laws of the United States, which is intended to intimidate or influence the policy of a government.
http://www.njsbf.com/njsbf/student/resp ... ossary.cfm

the unlawful use of or threat of, violence against persons or property to further political or social objectives.
http://www.saskschools.ca/curr_content/ ... vocab.html

employing acts or threats of violence. Terrorism is often used today as a political weapon to bring attention to a group’s goals or to gain those goals.
web.isp.cz/jcrane/Glossary.html

refers to the use of violence against noncombatants for the purpose of achieving a political goal, on a scale smaller than full-scale warfare. Acts of terrorism can be perpetrated by individuals, groups, or states, as an alternative to an open declaration of war, and are often carried out by those who otherwise feel powerless. States that sponsor or engage in the use of violence against civilians use neutral or positive terms to describe their own combatants, – such as freedom fighters, patriots, or paramilitaries. ..... Click the link for more information. and spies
encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/POWs

the calculated use of violence (or threat of violence) against civilians in order to attain goals that are political or religious or ideological in nature; this is done through intimindation or coercion or instilling fear
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Terrorism refers to the use of violence for the purpose of achieving a political, religious, or ideological goal. The targets of terrorist acts can be government officials, military personnel, people serving the interests of governments, or civilians. Acts of terror against military targets tend to blend into a strategy of guerrilla warfare. According to one view, one person's terrorist is another person's freedom fighter. Random violence against civilians (noncombatants) is the type of action
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism
Stryke

Post by Stryke »

I wonder if he ticked the little box asking about being involved in terrorisim , when he had to apply to work in the US
Guest

Post by Guest »

Deleted, humour in poor taste in light of london :cry:
Last edited by Guest on Thu Jul 07, 2005 6:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Bill Glasheen
Posts: 17299
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Location: Richmond, VA --- Louisville, KY

Post by Bill Glasheen »

Deleted response.

Thank you kindly, sir!

- Bill
User avatar
Bill Glasheen
Posts: 17299
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Location: Richmond, VA --- Louisville, KY

Post by Bill Glasheen »

Regardless of the issues of good taste, tasting good, and such, London does offer another metaphor for the issue Marcus brings up.

As I stated in my deleted post, there are issues of moral relativism. My Web research post above addresses some of this thinking, which points to some of the frustration Marcus and Laird speak of. One person's terrorist is another person's freedom fighter, right?

"London", "Madrid", and "9/11" remind us of the nonsense that comes of extremism and extremist behavior.

- Bill
Guest

Post by Guest »

Sorry Bill, just trying to expand the discussion, In light of the recent events my teasing / slash humour is out of line. But I thought my allying America and France might get a rise out of you. I dragged part of your post over hear because I agreed with the statement and thought it was worth repeating.

I hope you folks are sucesssful one day in ridding the world of these terrorist bastards. I'd like to see my nation join you and your allies in this endevour, however as long as we have the cowardly and dishonest liberal government at the helm...i'm afraid it will never happen.

It's a nasty world we live in today. I don't understand the motives of these groups. Maybe after we sort out the international terror mongers we can start working on the internal eco nuts as well.

I dispise those who would attempt to sell me their values via force and fear.

I hope that losses are minimal as the hunt for these dogs continues.
Guest

send this freedom fighter home!

Post by Guest »

B.C. court supports extradition of U.S. environmentalist wanted in Oregon

VANCOUVER (CP) - An environmentalist who is on the FBI's 10 Most Wanted list should be extradited to the United States to face arson charges, a B.C. Supreme Court judge ruled Thursday.
The final decision on whether Tre Arrow will be extradited rests with Justice Minister Irwin Cotler. Arrow, 30, a well-known environmentalist from Oregon, fled to Canada after he was charged with conspiring to commit arson against two logging companies in the Portland area and causing $250,000 in damage.

His extradition hearing was told by a Crown prosecutor acting for the United States that Arrow took part in buying, assembling and detonating explosives that were placed under several logging trucks that were firebombed in two separate incidents in 2001.

Arrow and his co-conspirators abandoned a third arson attempt on a U.S. Forest Service building because of security concerns, Crown lawyer Rosellina Dattilo told the hearing.




Arrow's lawyer argued the evidence was only hearsay and that U.S. authorities have nothing else against his client.

Arrow is seeking refugee status in Canada because of his fear of persecution in the United States.

Luigi Bianco, who met Arrow in a Vancouver restaurant about three years ago, said he hopes Arrow won't be extradited.



"He's a really soft guy and it would be disappointing to see him sent down to the States and be under political pressure and prosecution," Bianco said.

"He might, because of political pressure, be tried unfairly in the States."

Arrow has made a name for himself as an extremist environmentalist.

As an animal rights activist in 1998, he was arrested in Cincinnati wearing a pink bunny suit outside a Procter & Gamble executive's home.


He then moved to the Portland area, where in July 2000, he climbed the U.S. Forest Service regional headquarters building and lived on a 23-centimetre ledge for 11 days.

He was protesting a timber sale in the Mount Hood National Forest.

"He is an extremist, he does sit on ledges and he does prop himself up on trees but I can't see him burn something down like a logging truck or play around with arson," Bianco said.

Arrow introduced himself as Josh to Bianco and his wife, even though he lived in the couple's home for a while.

Arrow was arrested in Victoria by a Canadian Tire security officer in March 2004 while trying to steal a pair of bolt cutters.


He gave police a false name but checks revealed he was on the FBI's most wanted list as an alleged domestic terrorist.

Arrow, who legally changed his name from Michael Scarpitti, has been hospitalized while in custody because he lost weight after going on a hunger strike.

He eats only raw fruits and vegetables, supplied to him by supporters who say Arrow is concerned about wasted energy resources used to cook food.

Bianco said Arrow would often ask homeowners in Vancouver if he could pick figs from their trees and that if anyone refused, he would just return at night and pick the fruit without permission.

That's because Arrow thinks people shouldn't own trees, Bianco said.
User avatar
Bill Glasheen
Posts: 17299
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 1999 6:01 am
Location: Richmond, VA --- Louisville, KY

Post by Bill Glasheen »

Bianco said Arrow would often ask homeowners in Vancouver if he could pick figs from their trees and that if anyone refused, he would just return at night and pick the fruit without permission.

That's because Arrow thinks people shouldn't own trees, Bianco said
Yea, you can't own the trees - but the fruit are mine! This fellow isn't the missing link; he's someone missing a link. Or two...
Laird wrote: But I thought my allying America and France might get a rise out of you. I dragged part of your post over hear because I agreed with the statement and thought it was worth repeating.
Well you certainly got my attention, Laird. I just had a hard time figuring out where the heck YOU were coming from... :lol:

It makes no sense. That's THE most frustrating part of it all. These idiots think they are making a point or swaying opinions. Now and then - as in Madrid - they succeed in changing behavior. But lately, all we get is dead people and more of the same schit they protest about. Wow, THAT'S productive... :roll:

But if this was logical behavior, it wouldn't exist in its present form.

And if we had a few more leaders in the civilized world with cahones...

- Bill
Guest

Post by Guest »

Perhaps we should train our troops on how to perform Field Lobotomies.
Post Reply

Return to “Realist Training”