Good talk on blocks

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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Wed Oct 09, 2019 8:38 pm

A real fight is eons different that training in a sterile dojo in a martial art that is more related to a dance than actual combat. If you guys have never been in combat, or used force to defend yourself you should realize that you DO NOT KNOW how you will react until it happens.
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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:30 am

Worth a read.

But this is where I will tell you that not all training is good training. Nor are all techniques equally good.

Unless a technique takes into consideration the realities of the street, the factors of surprise and adrenaline, and the state of unreadiness at the start of the fight, that technique or method should not be taken seriously.
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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:41 am

Gabe Suarez
Martial students have a misunderstanding of distance interval because they train at artificial distances.

It shows up before the drill even begins, because the combatants in a sport agree to a starting distance, then their focus becomes one of moving in and out of distance to gain an advantage.

So managing and overcoming distance is always a factor in combat sports, but distance is already decided in a fight where you do not have the initiative.


This is an important distinction. You either have the initiative or you do not.

Its not a sparring bout, it is a street fight where one party decides to ambush the other. Nothing consensual about it.

There is no opportunity to change the distance. If you have that opportunity, you also have the initiative.

In fact, attempts to increase distance of ten play directly into the adversary’s line of attack.

No, the solution in events where you lack the initiative is in moving to the flank…to the angles.


On the importance of side stepping.
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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:44 am

Why you need to practice getting off the X...


Gabe Suarez
The two concepts are – Distance and Timing. In Karate they are called Maai, and Hyoshi.

But in a real street fight and not a competitive event, the distance is determined by the adversary as well as your perception of him.

If you realize the attack is coming at thirty feet, you may have options not available to you if you realized the attack was coming at three feet.

The point is simple – in the real world, the adversary often determines the distance, and that is only affected by your perception of the attacker and his plans.


Timing (and the physical manifestation of it – angular movement) is something you can control.

That control comes via correct training in context to an attack.

If you are no longer where the adversary is attacking, you have changed the timing, in essence, you have stolen the timing from him. And if you do that, and hit him well, the fight is won. But only patient students will learn this.
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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:48 am

Brent Yamamoto, Suarez International Tier 1 Staff Instructor
Excellent point about consensual matches. Those are all about distance. But that has nothing to do with the circumstances we are talking about.

We have some control over distance in proactive events. But the focus in this class was reactive situations where distance is entirely out of our hands. The bad guy gets a vote.

We have control over our timing and the angle of our movement, but no control over distance.

Distance is at best a function of our timing and movement in relation to our adversary. Perhaps that is too subtle for some but I think it is a huge distinction.
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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:56 am

How do you keep from getting stabbed in the Tueller drill run from 3 yards?

Increase linear distance by backing up? NO.

Change ANGULAR distance by moving laterally and to forward obliques
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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:58 am

In a reactive event I don’t have the time to even consider distance, let alone try to control it.

It is much easier to change an angle than to change distance once things have kicked off. Distance is great if you can maintain it or ambush from it but it is not always attainable. If it kicks off inside 5 yards you are unlikely to be able to create enough linear distance fast enough to matter.

If you can't back up fast enough to avoid a punch how will you back up fast enough to avoid a bullet?

How does one keep from getting hit by a train? Outrun it? NO.

Step off the tracks. CHANGE THE ANGLE.


How do you keep from getting stabbed in the Tueller drill run from 3 yards?

Increase linear distance by backing up? NO.

Change ANGULAR distance by moving laterally and to forward obliques.


Brent Yamamoto
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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 5:01 am

Distance is going to be controlled by the predator that initiates the action. You're right, the folks who's experience is strictly based in combative sports often don't realize this. When we are placed, by circumstances, in a reactive mode the only way to get ourselves on the right side of the power curve is to know how to control the angles and our timing.

Jim Miller international staff instructor
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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 5:04 am

Originally Posted by LV_MD View Post
Against a contact weapon, why not pick the 5 & 7 O'clock lines instead of the 1 & 11?


We do that. As discussed in class, it is to maintain status quo, but via angular movement. It is not a direct attempt to do anything with distancing, but rather an angular move intended to "take away" the enemy's turn.
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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 5:11 am

I tend to prefer 1 and 11 for dealing with hand and gun problems. I like 5 and 7 for dealing with knives, sticks, etc.

I think those are the ideal when one has a choice, but of course the situation and environment will dictate what is possible.



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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 5:21 am

I find that taking the 1:00 or 11:00 line on a contact weapon attack usually leads to a hand-to-hand intervention if your timing is even slightly off. I agree with Brent.

If we study human nature, there is little need for a firearms equipped man to be running toward you in order to shoot you, just as a man with a contact weapon won't brandish it without closing.

Maybe generalizations, maybe not...but we must start somewhere. Just as we can discern an enemy's intention vis-a-vis body language, we can develop expectations based on how the attack develops...or how we perceive the pressure.

A man running at you creates a certain type of pressure, whereas a pistol being aligned on you creates another.

When I discern a forward pressure (the running knife attack), my tendency is to move toward the 5:00 and 7:00 lines with a secondary line of evasion thrown in.

When I discern the pressure being a "point" rather than a rush, I tend to move forward obliques.

And the results in the drills bears that forward obliques work best with firearms, and rear obliques for contact weapons.

Nothing happens in a vacuum and your response is dependent on what you perceive and when you perceive it.



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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 5:25 am

Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel Suarez View Post



Against short contact weapons like knives I generally prefer an initial lateral move and then a redirect on a forward angle and a flanking move if it is available.

Think 2 or 3 steps to 3 o'clock then to 12 then back to 11 .

That will make them turn twice assuming they are still upright and mobile at that point. But sometimes unfortunately architecture/ surroundings might not always allow that.

A move to 5 or 7 with a lateral redirect (think 5 to 3 or even to 2 ) does the same thing causing them to have to stop and change direction.

The direction change buys you a tiny increment of time and allows you to open up angular distance from the contact weapon.

And as Gabe mentions moving to your forward obliques against a contact weapon (especially if it is within 2 arms length) can be problematic if your timing is off.

That's why lateral or rearward oblique initial movement to quickly "open up space to work" is preferable.

That's how you access your pistol without getting cut or stabbed initially. The more space you can make the longer you have to get your pistol out.
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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 5:33 am

What these lethal force trainers teach is what tends to keep people under attack alive longer.

Street fights will manifest with punks bearing some weapon, or multiple punks ganging up on you.

If you insist on getting into a sanchin stance and stand your ground, because you think you are so tough and conditioned, you will be cut to shreds with a blade and or stomped to death.
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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Thu Oct 10, 2019 6:04 am

Dynamics and Adversaries -

Most if not all threats will happen unexpectedly. For the private citizen, knowing there is about to be a fight usually involves evading and avoiding. That is you have not planned to go to the fight, rather you find yourself in the fight.

That adversary may be alone or with a couple of partners. They may be motivated by financial gain, status within the group (read "gang"), or for political or religious reasons they have targeted you (ISIS, BLM, ANTIFA, et al).

Their weapons may be as varied as anything available today - they do not care about collateral casualties nor about missing. Armor may be present, calling for face shots as the primary option and initial response to any threat.
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Re: Good talk on blocks

Postby Van Canna » Fri Oct 11, 2019 5:36 am

Crazy people are random. They pop up everywhere. Crazy people are ten times more likely in a city with ten times the population, but are still proportionately representative.

This means that you are just as likely to have a crazed murderer in 1,000 random people in Tupelo, Mississippi as you are 1,000 random people in San Francisco.

You can move somewhere with a lower violent crime rate. You can move somewhere that is less effected by the War on Drugs. But you can't escape crazy.

The number of people who are so far out of balance that they will take the plunge to commit mass murder is astronomically small.

But a corollary of that small sample size is that they end up randomly distributed throughout the world.

You can't get away from them. You can't meaningfully reduce your chances of encountering them. (Because the odds are super low no matter where you are.)

The lesson is this: You can't escape from this type of crime by moving to a place with less crime.
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